Muralist Francisco Letelier: “Human Being at-Large, Culturally Engaged”


By Suzanne Thompson

Born in Santiago, Chile, his family left Chile in the wake of the military overthrow of the democratically elected Salvador Allende government. His father, Orlando, was assassinated by a car bomb in Washington, D.C., in 1976.

Francisco and his brother José, along with Chilean painter René Castro, formed "Brigada Orlando Letelier," painting murals in 12 American cities and traveling to Nicaragua in 1980 to paint five more as part of a national literacy campaign. Now based in Venice with his wife Kayren Pace, sons Matias 11 and Salvador 13 months old. Letelier has worked on public art works, performances, installations, publications, and exhibitions in the United States and internationally. He writes, teaches, and lectures, and has worked with people of all ages creating collective and individual works, such as portable murals, banners, flags, books, medicine wheels, and earth mounds. In spring 1998, he traveled to Belfast, Ireland, to paint a mural of reconciliation with Protestant and Catholic community groups. He is currating an exhibition “Lights Among Shadows” to open this summer in Washington DC.

I first heard of Francisco through Greg Landau, when I asked him to do the art work for a program cover. A very dear friend of mine and wonderful photographer, Mary Ann Dolcemascolo, was hit by a truck on Main Street and did not have health insurance. Jackson Browne, whom Francisco had done album covers for, and I knew through my Central American solidarity days, had agreed to perform a benefit concert for Mary Ann.

Ever since then I’ve been interested in finding out more about Francisco and his work.

Suzanne:
Besides being a muralist, you are also a performing artist and a poet and an educator, and…What am I leaving out?

Francisco:
Human being at-large, culturally engaged. Things take a different route many times when you are kind of, just involved organically with groups of people. You are sort of called upon to fill a particular role. Which, I have always sort of done, in a willing and natural way. I think it has to do with my early political education. In Chile, I was a member of the Socialist youth and there was a lot of emphasis on taking rounds and leadership. You know, different people act as a leader - today it’s your turn.

Suzanne:
How old were you?

Francisco:
I started in the Chile Socialist Party as a youth; I’m not a member of the party anymore, when I was around 13, with the youth group. That was after the coup, in Chile in 1973. Returning to the United States, my brother Jose, who lived in a territory of Chile, but now he lives on Easter Island. He and I started a muralist brigade with young Chilean exiled youth. Since we were all very young kids working with older artists.

Suzanne:
Is that the Brigada Orlando Letelier named after your dad?

Francisco:
Yes. So it sort of came from that it would fall to us sometimes to be spokes people, other times to be doing the work on the wall, other times to be doing organizational things or logistical things. For example, I remember during a period when a lot of solidarity for Nicaragua was going on and you were in involved and Mancatol, and you were involved with a community of people bring groups. I would do a little bit of art work but most of the time; I was driving these guys around. I would offer to do it and do it. I would drive them around. I have given myself room to write. I really finally came out of the closet as a writer about 5 or 6 years ago when I finally took all of this stuff that I had and put it into a book. And said, “Okay, I guess I write.”

Suzanne:
And, which book was that?

Francisco:
Well, this is a self-published book. There are thousands of them around, circulating. And you know the other thing is that I’m not in a poet’s community. Poet’s have a very close knit community, especially here in Venice.

Suzanne:
Your art is not necessarily playing to packed houses. You are making a living on your art? Right?

Francisco:
Yes.

Suzanne:
But your poetry, or writing or your performances are something you don’t have to rely on.

Francisco:
I’ve made a little bit of money over the years writing. I’ve gotten a little bit of support in order to do it. The way I make my living is as a visual artist. Although, I’m the art director for a magazine called El Andar which is a national, bi-lingual, Latino magazine.

Suzanne:
Which takes me to your mural on Rose Avenue. It seems to me that you had a lot of community involvement in that project. Is that your first mural in Venice? You have others?

Francisco:
I have a couple murals in Venice. One is on Machado Street, off Lincoln Boulevard. There’s a taco stand that people stand out on the corner. I forget the name. Then there is this little street called Machado. There are these garden apartments on the left hand side called Machado Court Apartments. Some of the smallest apartments you could ever see. It is an environmental mural. It shows native species and animals of the Santa Monica Mountains. It was a mural in direct response to the people that lived there. They are mostly people from Mexico and other places. It was commissioned by the owner of the building. It is called Ambrosia.

Suzanne:
And where is the other mural?

Francisco:
The other mural is a mural that I finished concurrently with Becoming the Circle. That is at Phoenix High School. Which is the continuation high school behind Venice High School. It is a continuation high school for kids who have had trouble or who haven’t been able to get through high school in conventional ways. It is a small school on a street called Zanja. It was all done with high school students there last spring. It’s called “Phoenix Rising.” It’s not just a kid’s mural. I’m mentoring them all the way along. So I do a lot of the painting.

Suzanne:
Do you do the design? Or, do they do the design?

Francisco:
They do the design. I tweaked the design for them. I work the design and make it a little bit better. But basically, they are the art directors. It’s not just about painting. It’s about coming up with an idea, addressing issues that pertain to the community and the people involved with creating the mural. For them to feel free to image, to be creative and not worry about production.

Suzanne:
I think the Pioneer Bakery story is a wonderful story and I want to hear that.

Francisco:
About the mural at the Pioneer Bakery. I already had it in me that I was going to paint a mural. Somewhere in Venice. Somewhere in Oakwood. I wanted to paint a mural in Oakwood. I moved over to Oakwood on 6th Avenue. Now I’ve moved to Brooks Avenue. But it had been a really long time. These are the challenges for an organization like SPARC. . . Judy Baca is one of my cultural heroes. What we are talking about in community is human inter-action, friendships. It is your daily life with people in your community. If you’re a community member that gets along with lots of different people, you have friends, you have people you love, know this kid since they were two and you’ve known that person.

I was looking for a wall. Then I saw that SPARC was going through another funding cycle. So I wrote to them and said you know I want to apply for your funding cycle. I don’t have a particular site but I really want to paint a mural in Venice. In Oakwood. Because I feel that this is really the community that is undergoing the transformations that we talk about. They’re the people that are the living subjects of history. Los Angeles has this reputation as a mural mecca. SPARC has help create this mural mecca by commissioning all these murals for several years. The Venice Boardwalk is known for all its murals. And there are no murals in the Oakwood Community.

I approached Pioneer Bakery. They did not commission the mural. I just came in and said, “Can I use your wall?” I got some funding. I imagined that the mural will cost more because they had very little money at SPARC but I had enough money to start this project. And they said okay. Great! Since my idea for the mural was to actually paint portraits of a lot of people that lived in Venice – this really diverse group of people who lived in the community – who I felt were protagonists and leaders in their own kind of sub circles in community. It was automatically a community project because it was basically bringing all these different people together into one place.

Suzanne:
Did you do it alone? The design?

Francisco:
Yes. I did all the design. We really ran into some classic Venice situations. SPARC requires that you have public, community meetings during the design of the mural to have community input. So we called for a community meeting at Pioneer Bakery.

Suzanne:
What did you do?

Francisco:
We put up flyers all over Venice but mostly more towards the surrounding community; it was down on this side of Abbot Kinney, up along Rose, across Lincoln. So they put up these flyers. I come to the meeting. And guess what kind of people do you think showed up to a meeting like that? It’s at 5pm on a Wednesday. So, that pretty much leaves out a lot of working people. There is a link missing. The majority of community activism is engaged in confrontation and adversarial situations. Which of course it is. A lot of community activism is about “Hi. What’s your name?” “Where do you live?” “Oh, I live over here.” “Oh, so nice to meet you”. What goals can we create in common? What common ground do we have? So it was amazing because I had the initial designs for the mural and basically this room of people who I had never seen or met before, trashed all the designs.

Suzanne:
How many people were in the meeting?

Francisco:
Maybe 15 people. A few of my friends. They came, pre-disposed to say “Why is something happening in my community without my power?” So we are determined to come in and not let it happen because anything that happens is bad. We live in a world were everything is bad. I know a lot of people.

So if I go to a community meeting in Venice and I see a lot of people who are professional meeting goers but they are not involved in the community. I don’t see them at the drum circle. I never saw them hanging out somewhere at a coffee shop just being one of us. I’ve never seen them. I say, well I’ve lived here for 15 years I must have run into you somewhere. And did we catch our eyes? Did you look at me with some acceptance? So, I was feeling like there must be someway to win these people over to make them see that I’m not their enemy. I’m really a community artist. You must have me confused with someone else.

One discussion that occurred was that one part of the mural had a portrait of a young African American man, based on a photograph of one of these kids. I’ve worked with a lot of kids that have been involved with gangs, all over LA County. Kids that have been incarcerated and it was based on a portrait of a kid who had gone through this whole experience of being locked up, being in gangs, committing crimes and somehow managed to pull himself together, finish high school and go on to college.

This portrait was just my way of acknowledging that I live on the corner of 6th and Brooks Avenue in a place where over the years I’ve seen dozens of children get shot. Dozens of children get shot. You know it is very different to live in another place in Venice then to live right on the corner of 6th and Brooks where you see the crack come in and out. Attitudes are very different about the police, about what needs to be done, about racial harassment – about many things. I myself have been stopped by the police and put up against the wall and harassed before. Nevertheless, I welcome the police presence in my neighborhood because I have children and I have seen children die. My neighbors have died. I’ve seen kids die on the street. Children are killing themselves on the streets. So in my mural I thought it would be immoral to create a community mural without acknowledging the fact that dozens of children have died right in front of my house. There are no monuments. There is no mention of them. We need to leave a place where people can carry the pain and the memories of violence in their neighborhoods onto the wall. And, we are going to find an appropriate way of doing that. We are searching for that. That is what this project is about. It is about searching for common ground.

Suzanne:
Getting back to the Pioneer Bakery mural. What is in it?

Francisco:
During one of the first meetings, one of the oldest members of the family from the Pioneer Bakery, when we were coming up with ideas for the mural, said that he remembered that Rose use to be a really hot street. It was like the entrance to Venice, like the whole area. We used to have this parade here. Every year. One of my earliest memories was sitting on the balcony of this building. This is the same building. Just the facade got stucco covered.

Suzanne:
Did you know that Arthur Reese was brought to Venice from New Orleans by Abbot Kinney? I’ve read some books on the history of Venice and Kinney’s chauffeur was this black man, Arthur Reese who was very, very talented. He made these huge paper Mache Mardi Gras types of figures. He used real fruit, grapes to decorate the arches on Windward during Mardi Gras. At the end of the festivities, people were invited to enjoy the fruit or take it home.

Francisco:
It was great. You know, I wasn’t in anyway adverse to the idea of integrating the Pioneer Bakery into the mural. I found that to be the perfect image to start the mural with. So I said, let’s create a mural that has you on the balcony and the building as it was and that way we also show a little bit of the architectural legacy. The changing nature of what our place looks like. All very subtle but powerful. Here are three generations of families that lived here. This is beautiful. I love that. Where can we find a site? The idea was let’s show a parade and have locals be in the parade. So then it will turn into panels of different people doing there things in different places in Venice. So that is how the whole mural got developed.

Suzanne:
So, we didn’t really talk about money. Public money for art, for murals.

Francisco:
I came of age as an artist during the Reagan/Bush era. And so, the mantra that was given to me by my mentors, teachers and the social world was there is no money for art.

There’s no money for art. There’s no money for art. From then, to here, 20 years later or whatever, they are telling me, “They’re talking the money away.” But I thought there was no money? So guess what? I grew up and learned to be an artist with no money for art. And, I’ve been doing art this whole time with no money for it. I know there are some people who are loosing their fellowships. Some people who have the time. I’m always working really hard to survive and to pay the rent. They’ve had the time to be able to create the space in their life for two months where they could actually apply for this grant. Oh, there is some money coming up. The deadline is in October and I don’t have time…. you know it’s like fucking insane. Who has time to do that? I have to get up and go to work. So I realized, especially after the Pioneer Bakery, if I had been waiting to get the funding from somebody else, that project would never have occurred. A politics and the cultural politics and the multi-diversity blah…blah…blah... or the whole thing. I just choose to bypass it and go start to the heart. It just takes my body working on the wall.

Paint is pretty cheap. I can start it. I will create some momentum through the power of what human beings can do. Keep talking to one another. The old grassroots way. That’s the way I’ll do my projects for now. Maybe someday, I’ll get some enormous funding from things because I’m getting better. You know, like its Thursday night. There’s a deadline. I’m just going to do it. Everyone leave me alone. The kids won’t eat. Everyone in their spaces for forty-eight hours. I can pump it out and crank it out. I manage to do that sometimes.

Suzanne:
So then, how do these murals stay preserved?

Francisco:
If they are community murals, the community will take care of them.

The other thing about public art is that the state and cities don’t have mechanisms to which the population, or the electoral public, or the community can articulate their ideas about being people in the world. You know, they build this big enormous sky scraper right here and in no way does it talk about people. But you have to for this for your little thing over here. It’s all too crazy for me at this point. It just doesn’t make sense. It is wrong. Something is wrong there.

I feel like on one hand it is tragic that perhaps the city of Los Angeles will not be commissioning any more murals, at least through SPARC. I do think that it is a wonderful opportunity for SPARC to create murals in a different way, instead of being dependent on city funding and in that particular way they were depending on city funding. If your funding comes from one source and you do things in only one way you become ghettoized. Your audience starts becoming smaller and smaller. I don’t really have clear answers for everything. But, I am so grateful that I’m not completely encumbered by the bureaucracies that exist in this city in terms of cultural activities.

Suzanne:
And you brutally lost your father. Do you work in Chile?

Francisco:
I was just in Chile. We had an amazing thing happening in Chile right now. The present government, which is a socialist government, has decided that all the Chilean Diaspora, which is around a million individuals that left Chile, now number about 2 million or more Chileans living outside and abroad, they’ve decided to call us the 14th region. So we are another state. So, now for example I can receive healthcare. I can apply for public arts money as a Chilean. And, soon, perhaps I’ll vote. Chile is on the forefront of countries and nations imagining the idea of a nation completing surpassing national geographic borders.

So now my Chileaness isn’t any greater or less because I live outside or inside. It is about what is inside of me. Let’s say there were around 800,000 uniformed people that time in the country. Then, think about all their families and their children, we are talking about a third of the population in a small enough country still to image that we had the power to create a new way of life. You really start seeing the us and them. You understand to create a new society; you really better start shaking hands with a lot of people.

Suzanne:
I was reading your press release for the Pioneer Bakery mural and you said you were not interested in whether Pinochet goes to jail or not. It is more important to you that there is justice and people know the truth. A friend of mine disagrees with that. He feels that Pinochet is a criminal and he should be in jail.

Francisco:
I’m not saying the Pinochet shouldn’t go to jail and I wouldn’t fight the good fight for him to go to jail. It is more in response to what creates justice. Because the whole idea is to create justice. It’s not about revenge.

Suzanne:
So, what should we do with him? Pinochet. The truth is coming out and your family worked very hard for that to happen.

Francisco:
Other people involved in Pinochet’s regime can be put on trial. We can create, for example an international library. We’ve created the archives of memory which are akin to the kind of work the tolerance museums have done all over the country which is to rescuing all the information from those years. Also, creating mechanisms that allow people to have more healing.

Along with getting funded for commissioning murals, SPARC was also funded to maintain a mural inventory and restoration program. That’s been rustled away from SPARC. The thing is murals also need to be maintained. Public art needs to be maintained and there is nothing uglier than a mural in disrepair.
Especially, when it is a big, enormous mural. All the murals are covered with graffiti and where there is no mechanism to which we can repair the murals. The whole deal about a mural is that it perseveres and lasts through time. We do all this stuff to make sure that it lasts and we use the right materials.

I do think that there are a lot more crucial problems right now. I’m not going to be sitting around saying that “you should be restoring murals” when there’s hundreds of homeless on the street, when there’s kids being shot on the streets, and there is still crack running up and down ruining people’s lives in Oakwood. I think that the priorities are wrong. So, public art needs to be community art. Art that somehow, supposedly has its root in actual community.

Community is capable of bringing up the funds and taking care of these things. The community is capable and we have to give ourselves that power. We have to acknowledge that we have the power to do that.
This is only a fraction of the Letelier interview. The complete interview can be read on www.freevenice.org
All photos are from the Pioneer Bakery mural, except the center, bottom one with a deer. It is from the Machado Avenue mural.

Posted: Thu - May 1, 2003 at 06:01 PM          


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